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Sunday, April 15, 2007

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Chase Wright is being mentioned as one of the possible injury replacements. This (the injury situation) is getting beyond ridiculous.

Ooh, this'll be interesting. Moose is eligible to come off the 26th, and Pavano the 23rd I believe.

Now, Boston fans, will you let the Yankees off the hook because of injuries? Don't be hypocrites, now.

Me, I don't make lame excuses for failure. The Yanks'll tough it out like they always do.

Anyway, obviously Rasner keeps pitching. I've heard Chase Wright from Trenton is lined up to start Tuesday in Pavano's place.

I wonder if Mussina is eating those words he said about Pavano now?

Interesting - Pete says that this is a good day for the Hendricks brothers. But if the Yankees' hitting doesn't pick up their staff (and it very well could, such is the strength of the lineup), then that means the Yankees are in a bit of trouble. That would, if Roger is sincere about wanting to play for a team that can win it all, indicate bad news for the Yankees. Certainly from a negotiating standpoint Pete might be right, but it's arguable that the Yankees were already going to go to the mat for Clemens' services, so in some ways today's news doesn't change anything substantially.

As for "letting the Yankees off the hook" due to the injuries, in order to be fair we'll need to consider the fact that their rotation is in tatters. On the other hand, Andrew, the Yankees are going to live and die this year by their hitting, as far as I am concerned, and they still scare the crap out of me, offensively. So sure, this evens the playing field a little, but it certainly doesn't make things a foregone conclusion by any means.

To be fair, yes the rotation is a question mark and the Sox should take every opportunity to kick them when they are down. Saying that the Yanks will probably bring thier A+ game. Hitting as SF has pointed out is not in question. A Rod has been on his personal "love me tour" this early in the season does cause me some concern.

Wright's first game will come against Grady and the Indians. That's unfortunate.

Me, I don't make lame excuses for failure. The Yanks'll tough it out like they always do.

Easy to say when a game hasn't been played yet in this context. If they get swept next week, and fall 10 games off the pace as their staff remains injured into June, what's your story then? Will you be silent and let the DL speak for itself, or will you remind us of what happened to the best-laid plans? Somehow I doubt you (and some of your more vocal YF brethren) will have an impossible time keeping your mouths shut if this happens. (God, I hope this happens, if only to see how you follow through on your claim...)

Your bragadoccio is a bit silly, frankly, and kind of predictable. Explanations are not (always) excuses.

Actually, this shouldn't surprise anyone. Both guys have spend significant time (more so for Pavano) on the DL in the past three years. If my memory serves, Mussina has been there at least once year for 15 days/per in that span.
Listen, when we're talking about Pettitte, Mussina, or Schilling, none of us should be surprised by moves like this. We all knew it could, and probably would, happen at one point or another.

Ah, SF, speaking from your prickish High Horse as always.

In the context of the embarrassing Red Sox 3rd place finish, yes, explanations ARE excuses. How many times have we heard that the sole reason Coco Crisp failed last season was his broken finger? Where'd that argument go?

I have faith, is all, in the Yankee's situation. Sure, my faith will be shaken if it turns out Mussina misses much more time than his two weeks and the Yankees start losing, but injuries are an unfortunate part of the game that teams have to deal with. And my experience with the Yankees is that they are really rather good at dealing with injuries. If they don't, well, that's too bad. But I'm not going to wax philosophical and say "Oh, if only Mussina and Pavano were healthy and pitched 7-inning gems each time out," because that's worthless. You deal with what you have and you stand by your team regardless, instead of imagining a miraculous uninjured team that doesn't exist.

That's true, Brad, except with Moose, it always seems to happen later in the year when the wear and tear has gotten to him. This seems especially worrisome since it's happened so early. The only good thing is that the weather might give the Yanks some more resting time this coming week.

The Yanks have no need to worry, SF. They've stockpiled at least 132 certain hall of famers in trenton. Failure due to injury is not an option. ever.

You forgot the 3 future best pitchers ever to exist in AAA, and the transcendents who are destined to each pitch multiple perfect games in the majors in Tampa.

yes, I did forget to mention that.

The Yanks bullpen has pitched 47 innings thus far. 47. Holy Cow.

Yes, they've been excellent beyond my wildest dreams.

Now hopefully Andy can give them a well-deserved break before they need to relieve the starters in for Mussina and Pavano.

Why can't we all just get along?

Losing 3/5 of your starting rotation hurts, there's no way around that. Whether you want to or not, they'll take their toll. It's nothing to do with excuses, just common sense. If Yanks send out Karstens, Rasner and Chase Wright against Schilling, Beckett and DM, that's hardly a fair matchup, is it? At least on paper. Again, it's not making excuses, it's being realistic. Just as to say injuries played no part in Sox' collapse last season is specious.

Sorry if I have trouble imagining that most of the YF fandom, after fifteen years of dominance, will give a collective "Aw, shucks, better luck next year" should the team falter. That ain't happening, on this site or anywhere else. And if your team is losing for reasons that no rational person can deny revolve around injury...the hell else is there to say or think about besides, "Sh*t, I wish they were healthy?" There's nothing wrong with it; can still root for the team you have and pine for the team you could have had. That's basically what we had to do last season...I don't think anyone here stopped rooting, we just numbed the pain / dealt with a**hole Yankee fans by employing the wholly understandable, "look at all the injuries" meme.

Anyway, if the bullpen can somehow keep it together, this shouldn't be catastrophic. Of course, that won't happen if at least two or three starters a week go 6 or 7 innings; Bruney, Vizcaino, and Proctor are all on pace to throw around 20 April innings. Not good.

Cleveland isn't going to help their cause. :)

Right, YM. The difference with the Yankees this year is that their lineup is fearsome (when healthy!). The Sox last year were great in places, totally solid, but not scary from 1-7, offensively. I honestly think the Yankees' offense is scary good and that deep. When healthy, of course.

From my standpoint, I picked the Yankees to win the division, and I assumed they would pick up a set of injuries. Not necessarily all at once with their pitchers (and Matsui), as right now. But my thinking was that they would just score so many runs that they had a huge advantage, no matter who they throw on the mound. I still think that's the case, even with Hideki out. If these guys stay injured, then it's a big blow, but it still shouldn't be fatal. At least not until the playoffs.

Umm. It's early April folks. Yeah, the rotation is banged up at the moment, but none of the injuries appears to be too serious, so everyone should be back relatively soon. Yeah, the ages and histories of some of these guys are cause for concern, but isn't every pitcher a cause for concern? Let's not blow a couple of missed games in the first month out of proportion. Let's just see where everyone is in July.

Interesting that Andrew, Mr. "We'll soldier on," goes off on SF for being on a "prickish high horse."

Interesting, though, that YF's comment above is the first time I can recall a YF finally acknowleding that there are injury question marks surrounding the Yankee rotation, as there are in all rotations. After a spring of shooting down the Sox' starters for having so many question marks, I'm glad to see it only took three injuries to get that out.

Injuries were always question marks. St Louis, who won the WS had 3 pitchers with over 100 IP last year. Three! The fact is that all teams had injuries last year, including the sox and the yanks. The sox were unable to get over them and they finished third in a division they were predicted to win. Many of the yanks issues this year are the same as they were last year. Pavano. Aging starters. Cashman did a good job of seeing the same issues then he went out and got backup plans. Sanchez, Britton, and others. Time will tell but I feel confident. Its not like Ponson and Chacon were superstars.

I'd like to call on mentioning the 2006 Cardinals. They sucked, they played in a terrible division, and they got hot at the right time. That is all. Heh...

>>>The Yanks'll tough it out like they always do.<<<

You mean, they'll buy a bunch of replacement All Stars per usual (cf. Abreu, 2006)?

>>>Umm. It's early April folks.<<<

The 15th of the month is more typically known as "mid-April" ... But yeah, it's early in the season.

Nobody has noted the irony in the fact that Pete Abe, who coined the controversial phrase "maison des cartes" (we have a moratorium, remember, on the English version) is the guy who keeps breaking Yankee DL news.

May his good fortune, journalistically speaking, continue. ;-)

"...Interesting, though, that YF's comment above is the first time I can recall a YF finally acknowleding that there are injury question marks surrounding the Yankee rotation, as there are in all rotations...."

not quite true paul...i've said the same thing, while also acknowledging that the sox rotation appeared more set with shilling, a healthy wakefield, a rebound by beckett, and that i believed dmat was the real deal...i was actually more concerned about performance issues with the yankee starters than i was with injuries...looks like both of my worst fears came true...

Funny thing about injuries is that they don't discriminate. So take all the pleasure you can now Sox fans, the season is 162 games long and in the end the injury bug bites every team.

"After a spring of shooting down the Sox' starters for having so many question marks, I'm glad to see it only took three injuries to get that out."

A- Who was shooting down your rotation? I can recall people questioning the back end (Wake and whoever you trot out at #5), but never the front 3.

B- Will there ever come a day that you Sox fans stop playing the underdog poor me role? Those days are over. You are big spenders, big boys on the block now, stop the us against the world BS.

As for the Yankees, everything will be just fine. These are injuries that have ZERO to do with age, just bad luck. If Sox fans want to keep playing the I told you so/age card, so be it. Yanks fans just keep that in mind when old Red Light goes down, don't hold back live it up when that day comes! God knows they never do.

Trisk:

"Who was shooting down your rotation?"

Followed by:

"Yanks fans just keep that in mind when old Red Light goes down ..."

You just made my case. I recall many comments by YFs questioning Schilling's age/health and Beckett's blisters, as well as Matsuzaka's inexperience/innings history. Not that these aren't valid concerns, but they were of such a nature that the same concerns existed for the Yanks' rotation (Mussina's age/health, Pettitte's elbow/back, etc). dc aside, I heard very little acknowledgment from YFs that the Yanks' rotation was just as vulnerable to injury as the Sox'.

Trisk: you misquote Paul. He says "shooting down the Sox' starters for having so many question marks".

His statement is accurate. A good number of comments from YFs were heavily qualified this way. The fact is that it's way too early to dismiss those questions, even still. But the whole "all is well, remain calm" cry that Yanks fans are issuing now comes off as a bit of primping and loud talk even as the gun is starting to run out of bullets. I imagine you'd have some interesting thoughts to send our way were Beckett and Schilling both riding the DL right now while we Sox fans were calmly saying "feh, we'll still kick your asses". That's what it sounds like right now, from some of the YF camp. The reality is that Yankees fans should still feel pretty good about their teams' chances (their offense is world-class, the hand grenade to use in absence of the empty rifle), but there's got to be some trepidation about what's happened.

As for the injuries having nothing to do with age, I think that's just a little bit presumptuous, particularly with regards to Mussina. Moose is getting on and has had a recurring history of DL appearances; I can't help but think that his ability to heal fully is being affected by his age. With Wang age is clearly not the issue. With Pavano, I'd say it's more like he's just aging really, really fast. Pure age isn't an issue, though baseball age seems like it might be.

I just don't see how someones age can cause Hamstring issues. Especially considering that there are 2 other players on the same team with the same injuries. But hey whatever floats your boat, if it's caused by age then so be it. It is what it is.

As for Paul, I didn't use Schilling as an example because he's old or injury prone, UGGH! I was simply saying Yankee fans shouldn't take the high road when a player from the Sox eventually goes down. Ok so I retract my statement and reissue a new one...When Beckett goes down...better? I can't speak for anyone other then myself, but I never thought the Sox would have health issues in their rotation. I thought the problem, if there even was one, was 4 and 5, BUT with that offense even 4 and 5 shouldn't be an issue.

We agree on that, Trisk, except for the 4. Wake's injury last year was definitely a fluke, and history has showen knuckleballers are often at their best in their 40s. Your brethren, however, expressed some different sentiments re: the Sox' top three.

Trisk: I am not saying it was age that made Moose's hammy bad. I am saying that age makes Moose (and others like him who have had recurring DL visits as they've gotten older) more prone to any injury. Is this controversial?

Older players I would agree have an increased chance of injury, unless their name is Roger Clemens. But hammy's are not age related, nor should they cause other issues down the road. Moose tweeked his hamstring, so be it. Doesn't mean this is a sign of things to come for him injury wise, this was a fluke thing. Tweeking a hammy comes from things like running on uneven ground, landing incorrectly, etc...

Paul, like I said I can't speak for them, but to think the Sox Big 3 were ever a question mark is idiotic. As for Wake, not a fan, in a Game 7 I would be excited to see Wake, as opposed to any of the Big 3.

I hear ya, Trisk. He makes me nervous, thanks to the ever-unpredictable knuckler. Though he was excellent in the '03 ALCS before that homer, and we all know how the game never should have even gotten to that point.

I wouldn't have any problem with Sox fans saying "we'll still kick your asses" even if their two top starters went down. Sure, I'll think they're misguided, but where do people get off saying that having faith in your team against all odds is wrong?

Obviously the Yankees aren't playing well right now, but what's wrong with expressing confidence in their future? Mussina and Wang will come back, and the Yankee rotation will be as strong as anyone's. And then what questions will there be? That's where my misguided hope comes from.

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